Double bowline

[Hepbie]

Quotation:
We here only recently the double bowline (that, which it is drawn before the book Of , because by the name “double bowline” I I know as the minimum three different units). Greatly it was pleased. During the small complication on with there are simply the bowline many advantages. Hippie, and you what double bowline do imply? You already did get dry? Give the promised individual theme.
I know two units:
1. . it is used for blocking the cowards with the underbodice
And strictly, double bowline (requires control unit, it is absent on the photo! ):

The second version is faster bowline from the double rope.

[Hepbie]

Before both versions to load is possible only one of the free ends.
the question: what and why?

[WxEdeEogle]

I tie my ropes precisely about the second version.

But I only 1, and to load there is possible any end.

[Hepbie]

wrote (a):
But I only 1, and to there is possible any end.
For the sake of Kostya, and as you do tie the first version around the support, beyond which it is not possible to hook up loop? By one end?

by this unit to is that to rope to the arbor… some by end.

[Hepbie]

wrote (a):
by this unit to is that to rope to the arbor… some by end.
This yes. When end - two meters. To tie ropes to the attachment point would be problematic:)

no problems, if point - tube what , but meaning? is sufficient single, the main thing, so that the foundation and the insurance on the different points would be fixed.

[Nl.L.]

I do tie 2, here only question - and for the sake of which of the ends cannot be loaded? I on my grayness did assume that both possible. ... we do make the control (+ I still to by its snap hook beside the rope), but two coming-out together ends down the equal degree of . was intended not this? or I am unjust? please, comments…





Mr.L wrote (a):
I do tie 2, here only question - and for the sake of which of the ends cannot be loaded? I on my grayness did assume that both possible. ... we do make the control (+ I still to by its snap hook beside the rope), but two coming-out together ends down the equal degree of . was intended not this? or I am unjust? please, comments…
Yes any it is possible, any… Are possible two immediately.

[Nl.L.]

I also so always considered, thanks.





About the rules before , to work necessarily on two ropes, consolidating each beside its, independent from another, point. Therefore, using this method of consolidation (bowline by the dual rope), to hang against these two ends can different people, which have on the second independent insurance, but on no account one , which uses one branch as lowering, and another as the insurance - this is not permissible!

[Nl.L.]

Aha - the excellent explanation

[Hepbie]

About the rules before , to work necessarily on two ropes, consolidating each beside its, independent from another, point.
I would introduce refinement. If the durability of the attachment point before 10- curies of times exceeds necessary ( - shaft, for example, metal structure what- filament), both ropes can be tied to one point, but for the sake of separate units, by loops and the like
Thus, if we have one rope even one attachment point, the dual bowline we tie two times.

[Nl.L.]

But it is possible picture?





About the rules before , to work necessarily on two ropes, consolidating each beside its, independent from another, point.
I would introduce refinement. If the durability of the attachment point before 10- curies of times exceeds necessary ( - shaft, for example, metal structure what- filament), both ropes can be tied to one point, but for the sake of separate units, by loops and the like
Thus, if we have one rope even one attachment point, the dual bowline we tie two times.
Excuse, Sasha, but this is not envisaged by rules on . Only isolated points! But if you was mistaken with the evaluation of reliability? It is because, strictly, and they work on two ropes.

Only isolated points! But if you was mistaken with the evaluation of reliability? It is because, strictly, and they work on two ropes.
With the evaluation of the durability / of it is difficult of
............................ Lans, I keep silent

[Hepbie]

Hippie wrote (a):
I would introduce refinement. If the durability of the attachment point before 10- curies of times exceeds necessary ( - shaft, for example, metal structure what- filament), both ropes can be tied to one point, but for the sake of separate units, by loops and the like
Thus, if we have one rope even one attachment point, the dual bowline we tie two times.
Excuse, Sasha, but this is not envisaged by rules on . Only isolated points! But if you was mistaken with the evaluation of reliability? It is because, strictly, and they work on two ropes.





Yes, hardly we will become to bind its double bowlines, but point fastening- that all -equal one!





Yes, hardly we will become to bind its double bowlines, but point fastening- that all -equal one!
Based on this the method of considerations it is possible to say what do we have always one point - building- that, on which we work before the given moment - one. Apropos cabin - be bored, place rings and insure to them, there will be many points.

[WxEdeEogle]

Apropos cabin - be bored, place rings and insure to them, there will be many points.
Why???!!!!
Is much simpler and more reliably to bind it around by double rope and to already beside it /to tie in its workers.





Then, at least, which is required on . But rule - they by the blood are written. It is written - the individual independent points, to be the individual independent points. Represent that something happened with one of the loops, and it turns out that both ropes were fixed, but fixed- that on one, but peasant- that do not know! But there will be isolated points - you will immediately feel that of two ropes in you remained only one and - you will undertake measures to the rescue of your life.
Shorter - to suck here - there is it directed, it must be implemented. It will suffice to confuse young people, it is small, who and with what preparation this reads.

[WxEdeEogle]

Nevertheless it did not convince. The ring set as far as you cannot be more reliable than the very of / of cabin.





But young people let read and wind on the basis of the whisker our disputes - before them the truth is born.





Nevertheless it did not convince. The ring set as far as you cannot be more reliable than the very of / of cabin.





But young people let read and wind on the basis of the whisker our disputes - before them the truth is born.
Precisely. But that logic “if in you is one point of attachment; you will fasten down it two other attachment points - and there will be to you happiness” is somehow somewhat strange

It is possible to tie each rope separately down the cabin, and will be observed the rule of the points of insurance.

[mald-sem]

Situation - sloping tectum of small house…
fire staircase as the attachment point confidence does not cause. :.





We bind around the tube of 5-6 strands of rope and stick all this matter.
I note NOT 5-6 revolutions, but 5-6 STRANDS - i.e. if one will be cut - others not “will crawl”…
SO here beside THIS improvised ring 3-4 people and they work - truth not based on one side….
WELL it is not only necessary to speak that this not on ….:.
This tube, probably weighs ton….
ABOUT THE BLOOD on the pages of the book on - noticed correctly - however, basic DANGER waits us above the bend on one rope, and before the window …

[WxEdeEogle]

wrote (a):
It is possible down the cabin to tie each rope separately…
So I this bore in mind.
mart-sem wrote (a):
… fire staircase as the attachment point confidence does not cause. :.
Why it does not cause? Not on it down the tectum it was raised?

[Hepbie]

wrote (a):
It is possible down the cabin to tie each rope separately…
So I this bore in mind.
But now attentively we look, based on what this unit of the discussion was begun:
Hippie wrote (a):
If the durability of the attachment point before 10- curies of times exceeds necessary ( - shaft, for example, metal structure what- filament), both ropes can be tied to one point, but for the sake of separate units, by loops and the like





mart-sem wrote (a):
… fire staircase as the attachment point confidence does not cause. :.
Why it does not cause? Not on it down the tectum it was raised?
But here is not caused, and everything. In the center of Moscow fire - it is simple horror some. Often this appears so - several half-rotten steel sections, set down each other (by in no way with each other of those not fastened - coupling links have long ago they rotted and they break off by hands, disintegrating beside the pieces of rust), and all this matter is simply leant according to the wall…





By the way about the fire staircases. Somehow fire staircase was placed. Client gave fastening elements… Staircase weighed ton two, it was assembled in parts by means of the crane truck, and fastening… - 8 millimeters the lag bolts of the long of centimeters 10 on the scabbiest dowels on 35 millimeters!!! Before the brick plastered wall… They placed on two dowels consistently, otherwise - generally it could fall immediately
When they hung all, Of on the tectum of rope was removed - it threw down down and it was going to go down the garret. I tell it: “Where it did go? There, on the new staircase be lowered!” On that there was the reasonable response: “On this staircase to be lowered? Without the insurance?!!!”

[wbn]

The phrase was pleased:)
Quotation:
BGS wrote (a):
We here only recently the double bowline (that, which it is drawn before the book Of , because by the name “double bowline” I I know as the minimum three different units). Greatly it was pleased.
But here still several bowlines

[wbn]

the pieces of 40 bowlines

[wonjalb]

Steeply.
Before the knowledge force, while before ignorance stability.
Question, and before all these units?

[wbn]

BGS, you can continue to devise units, it can have you for this sufficient experience. As you themselves speak on this forum, you suspect, that there can be you already grand-dad. Rad at the point of you.
BUT… That who wishes to wait for grandsons I I recommend not to put to use your units. For them, I again repeat picture, as it is correct to tie those two bowlines.
I think these units are already beautiful, reliable and simple. And they do not need improvement. But that as not to improve bowline to… well themselves you know to what:)

This unit is located concerning the address
http://ecole-flancaese-de-speleologie.son/jit/shaese/cxaisi.hdn
But this on the forum av url
By the way, something forum now is not opened - it had time to copy earlier.





on ecoli-francaise-de-speleologie.sam it is like also drawn.
So before than the difference, wbl, before barely not so the operating end.
Really this so ?

[Rica- dhi X]

But I by here coming from the opposite direction eight am compatible, well unit is certainly beautiful, only here why to devise bicycle?

I by the latter of . itself his of . before it is compressed a little less than beside . and he like better.

The forum av url earned.
Additive of -.





It so it names - TRIPLE COMING FROM THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION BOWLINE.
In general more interestingly is received.
But control knot as BGS, , you do tie, or and it is so sufficiently reliable as in Frenchmen?

[rizo]

Unit interesting and, like, works. For the functional check before “incorrect” directions it is necessary to conduct tests with good loads.
But there is a real danger of the inaccurate tying of unit.
From the classical bowline
is received the unit, which will sail even under the light load. Weight does not maintain man
But from “incorrect” bowline
this unit is received.
In this case, it must be noted, that both bowlines and classical and “incorrect” before servicing of end beside the loop, work equally.

ATTENTION!!! DANGER!!!





Operating end in bowline must work into loop, but NOT OUTSIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
These are not only my “opinion”, but also more than “authoritative” person for many - .
Figure from its book:

[rizo]

Your opinion, as the minimum .
although there is with the tail inward
It follows from this that before improvement both versions of tying work equally, that I noted before my post.
But further strengthening by the method pointed out above leads down the diametrically opposite results

[rizo]

wrote (a):
ATTENTION!!! DANGER!!!





Operating end in bowline must work into loop, but NOT OUTSIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
These are not only my “opinion”, but also more than “authoritative” person for many - .
Figure from its book:
For me there is one authority - its own experience. Many “authoritative” people before their books claimed that the seizing unit more reliably works with “hare lugs”.
But units and ropes I tore before the tensile testing machine quite sufficiently. Bowline worked equally. But further improvement, without the adequate consideration of . how I imparted.
By the way. Many “authoritative” people give the wild percentages of weakening rope before the units. To 70%. Of my experience more than all (to 30%) weakens coming from the opposite direction, of all (5%) , and remaining 15-20%.





Yes without the difference, down which side tail. It works equally. These are the correct bowlines
Incorrect is characterized by fact, where tail, but around what branch loop. Here incorrect:

p4i4a wrote (a):
But as bowline can be stuck incorrectly???
This is riddle for me (well it is certainly possible, but only this it will be considerably longer on the time than correct).
The very same are compatible down “time two three”, if “time two three” not receive- means incorrectly at least me then they taught.
It is easy. Especially the first time. When you tie not for the sake of one end (this generally super-rarely) and not for the sake of one-armed method shown before
http://animatetknots.som/indexclinving.php?LogaImage=&Wibsite=www.amematedknots.cam
, but as usually beginning around the palm you extract NOT ROOT end. The first days it made mistakes it sometimes and extracted not that branch. It bandaged.
… Generally automatism before the units comes more lately. But I after binding visually always monitor ANY of the units utilized as far as me. To repair, to form, to retract overlap, to tighten and so forth of seconds is not pitiful. There were no situations, when even before the dark and in the absence lamp it was not possible to visually estimate that tied -.

[WxEdeEogle]

rezo wrote (a):
Many “authoritative” people before their books claimed that the seizing unit more reliably works with “hare lugs”.
Yes already…
These hare ears with that seizing were dethroned at the first still tests.

[WxEdeEogle]

wrote (a):
When you tie not for the sake of one end (this generally super-rarely) and not for the sake of one-armed method, but as usually beginning around the palm…
Before it is interesting!
But I whereas do tie?
If not one of higher than enumerated methods I use.
Dispute about the tail inward/on the forum already was outside. Refer to what .

[Baven T]

. Somehow already here he wrote, but I will be repeated… Bowline is inclined down during fastening of rope to the supports of great size with the bearings (brick superstructures, for example). This occurs when the branches, which generate loop, obtuse angle is formed against the emergence based on the unit. I now speak about the classical “correct” bowline on the version Of .

But before the latter photograph by chance not “Kalmik woman”?





wrote (a):
But before the latter photograph by chance not “Kalmik woman”?
No. Kalmik woman - . But this Cossack.

But as it does keep on the to measures, who? Where that read that “Kalmik woman” and “Cossack” they are considered as the reliable units. (my grandmother of cows it cables “by ”, one hand, not . to show as, and it slowly cannot, it is confused:)





Yes its horseradish it knows, as it keeps. Not who for the sake of zh tested specially. Although there is the opinion that it is equally reliable with the bowline. On any, it is necessary to tie down the control. Tie the control and there will be happiness.
You do not believe to one - tie two controls, it is possible on the different of those located.
Only close down the basis.

. already better than based on the , . as that of times made with the help of “the Kalmik woman”, signboard on it curtained.

[Duk]

Quotation:
Incorrect is characterized by fact, where tail, but around what branch loop.
This “incorrect” before the appropriate literature is given as special for the binding of side rail down the onion. By the way, even before this quality it does not feed. But there loads are those still. In general, I always considered that the bowline can be loaded before any direction. And it entered respectively.

[NsS]

Quotation:
I tie bowline as follows: I do make and before this do insert free end, as here it is possible to be mistaken?
Do not say… Not all so is simple. Even inserting in different ways (but this is nevertheless possible, verify) free end it is possible to obtain the different result:
But this is great error.
To a little more be mistaken it is possible when you tie this “”. I term truth did not comprehend (wildly I apologize myself at the point of the illiteracy)), but intuitively I am conjectured, that speech about that running, on .
So here, its binding it is possible also to approach based on the different sides.
When you capture through the loop end,
this must be precisely load side (on which will hang the cargo), then will come out bowline. But if this will be operating (which then envelops support), will come out Cossack.
: And an an even blunter question, if you do allow, and where beside snap hook???





McS wrote (a):
where beside snap hook?
As the controls, it is possible to use the most different units. In particular, guide by eight. To insert beside it snap hook - not problem.

[sdefam_keks]

But “Kalmik woman” photo is . But that I similar do not know…

[NsS]

stefan_keks wrote (a):
But “Kalmik woman” photo is . But that I similar do not know…
But to look for? Not difficultly like.

[sdefam_keks]

McS, by thanks, rescued lazy I it feared to entangle “Kalmik woman” with the first rescue - that also , but “he creeps”…

Pavel T wrote (a):
Bowline is inclined down during fastening of rope to the supports of great size with the bearings (brick superstructures, for example). This occurs when the branches, which generate loop, obtuse angle is formed against the emergence based on the unit. I now speak about the classical “correct” bowline on the version Of .
This strikes on the worthless rope, which stands by pole, down which the normal construction worker of one hundred years as copied, and is continued to the wire condition. With the frequent alternating down it. It is like noncritical, so me it seems. If there is a sufficient reserve of the length of free end, on top of that tightened control to the pile. By the way on entire family of conductor beyond this theme before the individual theme to somehow consider the photo- drawing of free end - on top of that and short - from the incorrectly tied units. But that the abyss of the people as most elementary units ties. But on the classical double (which not single on the middle of rope) bowline is not at all necessary - the very same the continuation of single, if we by one end continue.
Tuk wrote (a):
In general, I always considered that the bowline can be loaded before any direction. And it entered respectively.
I analogously act rarely if it grows impatient: it is straight “operating” loop (which around the support of ) I can load, insure () and so forth the very same beyond three sides it works

[Xopih]

wrote (a):
Tuk wrote (a):
In general, I always considered that the bowline can be loaded before any direction. And it entered respectively.
I analogously act rarely if it grows impatient: it is straight “operating” loop (which around the support of ) I can load, insure () and so forth the very same beyond three sides it works
, and here is in my opinion. here somewhere on the site it hang one of “the selections of flights”, where the flight happened exactly because before the loop of the bowline of and was hung out , while on the unit itself before “authorized” regime already it hang another - unit as a result crawled.

[Beort]

clever things now and then write. there is what and whom to learn…
and now and then you will read a little:. and you do not know they or to cry?!
it can cover theme? or to create individual branch “units or how is characterized by double bowline based on….all remaining?”

[FeDarav]

By the way about the fire staircases. Somehow fire staircase was placed. Client gave fastening elements… Staircase weighed ton two, it was assembled in parts by means of the crane truck, and fastening… - 8 millimeters the lag bolts of the long of centimeters 10 on the scabbiest dowels on 35 millimeters!!! Before the brick plastered wall… They placed on two dowels consistently, otherwise - generally it could fall immediately
When they hung all, Of on the tectum of rope was removed - it threw down down and it was going to go down the garret. I tell it: “Where it did go? There, on the new staircase be lowered!” On that there was the reasonable response: “On this staircase to be lowered? Without the insurance?!!!”
And that who can overpower . the staircase through of tectum fear if it even itself it falls off that YOU will fly not down, but beside the top

[rizo]

Fedorov wrote (a):
if it even itself falls off that YOU will fly not down, but beside the top
From the direction of flight to you it will be merrier? You will especially because as a result nevertheless arrive flying down

[rizo]

Beard wrote (a):
clever things now and then write. there is what and whom to learn…
and now and then you will read a little:. and you do not know they or to cry?!
it can cover theme? or to create individual branch “units or how is characterized by double bowline based on….all remaining?”
to laugh - is , to cry - look on Mondays beside 18-20 " wait me”, or create individual branch and explain to us, as far as blunt, the difference between the units.

[aneh45]

rezo wrote (a):
create individual branch and explain to us, as far as blunt, the difference between the units.
So nevertheless indeed not

Xopek wrote (a):
wrote (a):
Tuk wrote (a):
In general, I always considered that the bowline can be loaded before any direction. And it entered respectively.
I analogously act rarely if it grows impatient: it is straight “operating” loop (which around the support of ) I can load, insure () and so forth the very same beyond three sides it works
, and here is in my opinion. here somewhere on the site it hang one of “the selections of flights”, where the flight happened exactly because before the loop of the bowline of and was hung out , while on the unit itself before “authorized” regime already it hang another - unit as a result crawled.
Polecat, and here is fig, in my opinion! On! Attentively read, THAT wrote itself. Based on your words of the second it beside the loop. It is implied, type it to the unit of no relation has the first already before “authorized” regime it hang on the unit itself. Here to you and sharp alternating loads and direction and the separation of this unit itself.
And that others. Speaking about beside the loop of bowline very sometimes, I bore in mind, the short-term backup insurance of someone (something) it is possible with the loading or without it, but not simultaneous with this “authorized” regime. And in me it is nowhere said, that down ONE unit leave TWO “authorized” units yes moreover living, and furthermore they on the branches of those coming out BASED ON THE UNIT before THE DIFFERENT directions. although there mom of 10 ropes is tied by this of !! Because it - ONE
I fight here with the comrade. If bases on the closed supports make, then it loves to make against each end of the base for unit, this by ring. But then to this base of all (poles and it is other). Its motivation: convenient to , to change down another support, to and to . This zh of 5 . Oho- GO! My objections: 1) excess unit before the circuit, to me to more simply connect base, but not to ; 2) ALL through ONE connector, it is unimportant that down 5 of , which you carry, you convey, fling and so forth….place the second snap hook then, at least 2 without the clutch are coming from the opposite direction.





I generally frequently use base stations from 11-12 (or dual of 10, by sometimes dual cords) on one, than it is simple bowlines. Especially if the bearing of the load application to the support frequently is changed. This in order not to move unit around the support. The fact that “excess” unit before the circuit whereas (base is connected somehow - usually Flemish (coming from the opposite direction) it weakens - nonsense. Base is usually more powerful than the pole (rope). First down that leaves.
… Better simply give reference before that case.

In general I wished to draw attention to .
On his increased, in comparison with THE BOWLINE, “consumer qualities”.
So that also they would try, they investigated, considered.
But once thus.
Po- occasion of authorities.
But for me and tensile testing machine - not authority.
Exactly double guide - “hare lugs” many counted more reliably with that seizing, because they tested practically before the statics - before the tensile testing machine. When managed evenly to be tightened both “the filaments” of rope. But before the dynamics, it is nearer to reality, proved to be entirely another result.
The study of the pages, reference down the figures based on which gave, for example, rezo, it showed that most frequently this is simple the carelessness of the authors of the figures. Is sometimes on one page drawn the process of the binding of the unit, as a result which is received “correct” bowline, and before the final figure, on the same page, (for example, beside ), tail outside.





In some places with the figure by tail is outside indicated “the source”, which leads, in addition down the correct unit. I.e., many “authors” carelessly draw again. By them it is unimportantly simple!!!!!!
And only in one place!!!!! , down http://aninatedkmots.son/, besides the bowline, is given attention and to incorrect bowline.
This description is given:
“Alternative Of structures: When of tied as of shown in of the of illustrations of above, the of bitter of end of lies in of the of middle of of the of loop. Passing of the of end of the of opposite of way of round of the of standing of end of forms a “Dutch Of marine” or “Of left Of handed” of bowline (picture on of right). It performs of satisfactorily - the Of dutch Of navy of says of better - but is of much of less of used in of other of countries.”
My PROMT translated this thus: “The alternative structures: When tied as shown in illustrations it is above, basic end is located before the middle of loop. Transmitting end the opposite route around the constant end forms “Holland sea” or “left entrusted " unit (picture on the law). This is implemented satisfactorily - Holland fleet speaks better - but considerably less it is used in other countries”
It is honest, I myself did not see the particular difference before the ability to be dissolved units with the internal and external end with the varying loads.
However. Many units differ from each other insignificantly.
Barely not so the rope - and has already been received the unit, completely for other targets and having another name. The sometimes even only different method of the pulling of one and the same unit leads down the different properties. Example - flat unit.
Sum: at the point of some reasons, possibly, by purely historical, the name “bowline” was fastened at the point of with the operating end, which exits inward. Everything else, as showed “discussion” before this theme, not “incorrect bowlines”, but OTHER simply UNITS.
And therefore, when you will tie somewhere the unit of the different versions on the tectum, you so say that they did connect some Kalmik woman, Cossack whether, or another unit.
But bowline - this that, which BOWLINE.